Minutes of the Eight OGSI-WG Teleconference 02/10/2002 @ 15:00-16:30 GMT Attendees: Tim Banks Karl Czajkowski Shel Finkelstein Steve Graham Andrew Grimshaw Bill Horn Fred Maciel Andreas Savva Frank Siebenlist David Snelling Steve Teucke Peter Vanderbilt 1) Approval of minutes form Setpember 25th. OK 2) Review of pending actions: Time: Wednesday, October 2nd 08:00-09:30 US Pacific (GMT - 7) 09:00-10:30 US Mountain (GMT - 6) 10:00-11:30 US Central (GMT - 5) 11:00-12:30 US Eastern (GMT - 4) 15:00-16:30 GMT 16:00-17:30 UK (GMT + 1) 17:00-18:30 Central Europe (GMT + 2) 00:00-01:30 Japan Place: Phone: Correct through GGF6. Phone number: 1-484-630-5376 Pass code: 93031 IRC: DALnet #ogsi 1) Approval of minutes form Setpember 25th. 2) Review of pending actions: Action: Steve Graham to drive the creation of an XML Schema for the specification, #35 - Pending, but may be dealt with in a breakout at GGF6. Action: Steve Graham to craft language for recommendations to developers for use of resolvers. Pending, but may be a session at GGF6. Action: Dave Snelling and Andrew Grimshaw to look at requirements and solutions for pull like semantics - Pending with ideas forming. Action: Dave will look into a DeliverWithAck option. One issue is specifying which delivery operation should be used - Pending, but ties into the events and notifications discussions. [Minute takers note: My apologies for driving the following section a bit heavy handed, but there seems to be too much time spent in teleconferences without a clear indication of the topic or it's motivation.] Several actions around QoS issues: Note from the interim meeting minutes 4-6 September 2002: "Resolved: This WG does not need to address QoS issues of a GridService at this time." Therefore, our procedures indicate that anyone wishing to reopen this issue needs to produce a compelling case to the list. Therefore, pending approval at the next meeting, the new actions are: Action: Proponents of the inclusion of QoS specifications in Grid Service portTypes to produce documentation to the list justifying a reconsideration of this issue. The following action is therefore considered dropped. Once the above is completed, new actions along these lines may be required. Action: Proponents of specifying QoS at the binding only are asked to answer the following: How does reliable mesaging work in the absence of portType specification of QoS? How does the client/service request/provide it? - Dropped. Action: Steve Tueke will propose a binding layer project to OGSA WG, but he is not committed to dirve it. 3) Review of plans for GGF The following topics were identified, but we did not assign priorities: - Notification possibly divided into "Event-style mechanisms". - Extension relationship in the GS portTypes. - Collection interface hierarchy and operations. - Bugizlla issue review. - Interim strategy discussion (what to do while we wait for WSDL 1.2) - Resolver behavior and the semantics of multiple naming schemes. - Read-Write SDE's - Coherency semantics of multiple findServiceData operations. - Others from bug list. Just for your information, I will leave this here: Tuesday, October 15 07.00 - 08.00 GFSG meeting 08.30 - 09.30 Opening Plenary 10.00 - 11.30 OGSI WG Update 12.00 - 13.30 OGSA-SEC WG & DAIS WG session 1 14.00 - 15.30 OGSI WG Technical Discussion 16.00 - 17.30 OGSA WG 19.30 - 21.30 Social event Wednesday, October 16 07.00 - 08.00 GFSG meeting 08.00 - 09.30 DAIS WG session 2 10.00 - 11.30 OGSA WG 12.00 - 13.30 OGSI WG Technical Discussion 14.00 - 15.30 OGSI WG Technical Discussion 16.00 - 17.30 Unscheduled (Globus people have R&D 100 award ceremony) Thursday, October 17 07.00 - 08.00 GFSG meeting 08.00 - 09.30 OGSI WG Technical Discussion 10.00 - 11.30 Area meetings 12.00 - 13.30 Closing Plenary 4) Technical Agenda, Service Data Issues: Bug 21 - Interpretation of SDD mutability attribute on service description Resolved to follow the recommendation proposed in the bug. Mutable to be interpreted as "soft-append" for values present in the WSDL. Also, "append" to be changed to "extend" in the spec. SDE values are also to be defined as a "bag" in the syntax and if more semantics are needed (e.g. sets) they will appear in the documentation of the service. Bug 22 - What if SDE lifetime attributes are not specified? Resolved to mean "not known" - needs to be processed in bugzilla and the spec. Bug 23 - Expressing "forever" in SDE lifetime attributes Open, but pending the resolution of bug 19. This should also be switched to a factory bug. ------------ The following were discussed in open forum, without the intension of seeking resolution. Please comment to the list, so that we can proceed more quickly: Bug 48 - SDEs that should not be initialized in the WSDL The general feeling was that enough cases existed to justify some indication that a SDE should not be set in the WSDL. Whether this is in the syntax or the service data description needs resolution. Bug 51 - Read-Write SDEs There was broad support for this notion, but concrete proposals are needed. Bug 53 - queryByServiceDataName to allow multiple name parameters Again strong support for this issue. But the coherency of the values returned needs to be discussed, as does this issue effect the notification portTypes. --------------- These were not discussed. Bug 32 - xsd:float use is misleading Bug 34 - Model FindServiceData() & CreateService() specializations as methods Bug 40 - Does minOccurs=1 make sense in light of authorization? Bug 45 - serviceData type attribute is redundant Bug 46 - Proper interpretation of Mutability Bug 47 - Clarify terminology of serviceData Bug 54 - We need some way of specifying 'nothing' as an SDE in itself. 5) Open Issues being carried: - Track the IPR status of WSIL. - Should WS-Inspection document (or other formats) be explicitly noted in the spec? - Oinn's report on presence or absence of SDEs still be be discussed. - What assumptions can be made about the properties of a service resolved by a resolver? #43 The specialization of the DeliverNotification operation #44 Language linking notification subscriptions to SDEs. - Explore further the implications of subscriptions as Grid Services. - What does a successful return from a RegisterService call mean? #42 The distinction between 'void return' and 'no return' in some operations 6) Next meeting Time: Wednesday, October 9th 08:00-09:30 US Pacific (GMT - 7) 09:00-10:30 US Mountain (GMT - 6) 10:00-11:30 US Central (GMT - 5) 11:00-12:30 US Eastern (GMT - 4) 15:00-16:30 GMT 16:00-17:30 UK (GMT + 1) 17:00-18:30 Central Europe (GMT + 2) 00:00-01:30 Japan Place: Phone: Correct through GGF6. Phone number: 1-484-630-5376 Pass code: 93031 IRC: DALnet #ogsi Agenda: Try to get a better picture of what we will do at GGF and continue with service Data discussion.